Discussion Post: 2x03 - "Hollywoodland"

[wendelah1]

This is the discussion post for episode 2x03, "Hollywoodland." It is meant for folks who are watching the show on the U.S./Canadian schedule, but you should feel free to join in any time after you've seen the episode. Please try to keep comments spoiler-free of anything that comes after season two, episode three. Thank you!

Air Date: March 25, 2018 in the U.S. and Canada
Written by: Matt Whitney
Directed by: John Showalter

This is not the 15 second NBC promo for "Hollywoodland"; instead, it is the interview with the set designer "Timeless - Inside the Bunker," which I'd found on Twitter last week and couldn't get to embed here.

Watch on YouTube

Timeless recap: 'Hollywoodland'(Entertainment Weekly)
The Drama Intensifies When “Timeless” Visits “Hollywoodland” (The Smithsonian)
Timeless Recap: La La Land (Vulture)
Timeless Recap: La La Land (Den of Geek)
Timeless Season 2 Episode 3 Review: Hollywoodland (TV Fanatic)
‘Timeless’ Review: The Curse of Bad Timing in ‘Hollywoodland’ (TV Source Magazine)
‘Timeless’ 2×03 Review: You Saved My Life (fangirlish)
Timeless 2.3: Orson, Hedy, and Lucy (Paul Levinson: Infinite Regress)
Remember, if you can, watch in real time, tweet in real time, etc. If you're recording the episode to watch later, try to watch within three days. Those are the numbers that matter to the network because those are the numbers that matter to their advertisers.

Finally, for your listening pleasure, the Harry James Orchestra's 1941 recording of You Made Me Love You. It is going on my Timeless playlist for sure. ♥ ♥ ♥

Comments

[tinny]

am i really the first one this time?

I mostly liked this episode. That Mom and Keynes weren't in it helped a lot.

I somehow didn't feel the chemistry between Wyatt and Lucy in this ep (but I thought him stepping on her dress was funny). I did like their conversation, even though they weren't communicating well, were they? Lucy talked about being a nerd and that is something I can very much identify with. And instead of supporting her, he a) talks about this intimidating people (not him, no, whu?) and then goes and compliments her on her beauty? That did not work for me. The part that worked for me was when they confessed how the other made them want to live. *g*

I liked how cute Rufus was about finding out.

I'm not sure I like that they're just accidentally meeting important people this season. It's better than announcing it up front, I guess, like "yo, we're going to the Alamo", but otoh it feels a little tacked on.

I definitely don't like them stealing clothes. Rufus is very right about that.

I loved everything about Rufus in this ep. Not that that's anything special, he's always great. But it was unusual how he took the reins and pretended to be a famous writer. And all those looks he shot Lucy to help him out? Priceless.

I love how Lucy knows everything about everything in history. Not realistic, but I don't care as long as she's the smartest one around.

Oh, yeah, and she can sing, too. :D (I thought she was brilliant, but i didn't feel the chemistry there, either.)

Same with Flynn. I don't think Flynn could keep all those details in his head, though. (I guess I just don't like him as much as I like Lucy.) Didn't they take the diary from him, too? What do they need him for, anyway? I guess I missed/forgot that part.

Not that I'm against having him in the bunker, I want them to work together. Now he just needs to stop grimacing so much and we're good.

I didn't get the thing about Jiya's medical condition. Is it true or is she lying? I don't think she's that good of a liar, but why would she be healthier than before? That is weird. The rest of the storylines are progressing pretty quickly, only hers seems to be stalling a bit. Also weird.

(Agent Christopher's only reason for existing seems to be to say "and why didn't you tell me about this sooner"? It's a theme.)

I didn't expect Jessica to come back this fast. I am looking forward to how that plays out.

[wendelah1]

You are first. By 11 pm when the episode ends, sometimes I can't stay awake long enough to comment. I liked our old broadcast slot better.

As soon I'd finished listening to the interview with the showrunners where they talked about the new direction they were taking Timeless this season, I knew that the characters were in for the worst that the writers could throw at them. So I was certain that they'd bring Jessica back at some point. What I didn't expect was that she'd be an immediate romantic threat to Lucy and Wyatt. I mean, jeez. The scenes they had together were sweet and romantic but they didn't even get to be a couple for an entire episode, which sucks them and for the viewers who ship them. I've been watching more for the Time Team, their adventures, and the history lessons, so I'm more annoyed than heartbroken.

I somehow didn't feel the chemistry between Wyatt and Lucy in this ep (but I thought him stepping on her dress was funny). I did like their conversation, even though they weren't communicating well, were they? Lucy talked about being a nerd and that is something I can very much identify with. And instead of supporting her, he a) talks about this intimidating people (not him, no, whu?) and then goes and compliments her on her beauty? That did not work for me. The part that worked for me was when they confessed how the other made them want to live. *g*

Thank God! I thought I was the only one who thought the chemistry was a little forced between Lucy and Wyatt. Yes, I agree about the dialogue, too.

I guess the possibilities can be narrowed down: either Jessica didn't die because something either they or Rittenhouse did in 1941 changed the timeline, or she was never dead in the first place, reasons to be determined. I'm hoping for the former. If they make her a Rittenhouse agent I will be truly pissed. Bringing her back is bad enough, making her An Enemy of the State is too coincidental and involves rewriting too much of Wyatt's past. It is cruel to the character and facile besides. What an easy choice that would be for Wyatt to make—if your wife isn't who you thought she was, no problem, right? Wrong. It would be emotionally devastating for him. Let's not even think about how this is going to affect Lucy. Or Rufus. Or the work of trying to stop Rittenhouse.

I was dubious about the Rittenhouse plot. Stealing the only copy of Citizen Kane and trading it for one weekly column in the Hearst papers still seems pretty low stakes and high risk to me, and planting a mole in the studios back in the twenties when the film industry was just getting started? Really, guys? However, apart from the lack of a real lead for the team, it was put together neatly, and they maintained a consistently mad-cap, romantic mood, at least until the killing started. It worked reasonably well on the screen and that's what counts.

This business of shoplifting clothes is simply ridiculous. It's a unnecessary risk--people do go to jail for stealing stuff. I mean, come on. They have a time machine, for pete's sake, which means our heroes can wait long enough to procure the clothes they need legally before they embark. Wyatt breaking into the studio costume wardrobe to steal evening wear was funny, although I'd be worried that someone at the party might have recognized the gown Lucy was wearing.

Naturally, I loved all of the pop culture references. Rufus's attempt at impersonating Langston Hughes was amusing. (Rufus walking in on Lucy and Wyatt was funny, Rufus needling Wyatt was cute--Rufus is the best, as always!) Hedy Lamarr made a great character and her links to science and the film industry tied everything together, too. However, US patents can't be renewed--once they expire, the invention is in the public domain, which is how we eventually have low cost generic medications--so Lamarr can't be turned into an early tech mogul quite so easily. The writers should have known better.

Jiya's storyline never made sense to me and it still doesn't. Why was she the only one affected by the four people riding in a time machine built for three dilemma? Why would time traveling through a wormhole fix a heart murmur? I hope she's not lying but Connor Mason looked dubious, didn't he? I hope the writers know where they're going with this.

I live in Los Angeles. It looks to me like they landed the life boat in Griffith Park, which is a big place, but they set it down right out in the open and did nothing to cover their tracks. The prison in which Flynn was being held has to be in Chino--the California Institute for Men--which opened in 1941. It was a cute twist for the team to leave behind the tools he would need to facilitate his escape.

Speaking of the devil, now that Flynn has unofficially joined the Time Team, shouldn't there be more security, not less? How was he able to just waltz in? It was a little too easy for Wyatt to break out to go see his wife, too. And only Agent Christopher was armed? Who is in charge of this operation again? Homeland Security is not exactly short of funding. Ahem. It stands to reason that eventually Flynn's escape is going to get tied to someone. I hope Agent Christopher doesn't get caught up in the crossfire.

Flynn gave the diary to Lucy right before he got arrested. I thought I was the only one who remembered it. Since the end of last season, the characters (and writers) have forgotten its existence.

Obviously I'm in the minority but I find I'm not enjoying the emotional journeying, character-building--whatever it is the writers think they're doing this season--as much as I had hoped I would. Change is hard! I just want my silly time travel show back. Well, there's always season one to rewatch.

[tinny]

sometimes I can't stay awake long enough to comment.

Ah, yes, it would be too late for me, too. That's probably the only advantage for me: I can watch it whenever I like.

So I was certain that they'd bring Jessica back at some point. What I didn't expect was that she'd be an immediate romantic threat to Lucy and Wyatt.

It was a bit fast, yes.

If they make her a Rittenhouse agent I will be truly pissed.

That one podcast site you recced in one of your link posts immediately called that she's going to be Rittenhouse. I'm not much for speculating (because I suck at it), but I'm going to say they're probably right. Which sucks for several reasons. But even though I am totally into the Wyatt and Lucy ship, I don't really get so fannish about it that I hate Jessica coming back. I'm just looking forward to how everything's going to unfold. But you're right that making her Rittenhouse would be far less interesting than the alternative.

I like the time team as they are, too, and Jiya, and Agent Christopher, and Flynn - I have a lot of other things I care about on this show beside the ship. In fact, from the experience of this season so far, the thing that annoyed me most was when Lucy wasn't there to drive the story at the beginning of the premiere. If that is something that'll occur more often, or if they take agency away from Lucy in some way, I think I could get mad enough to stop watching.

They have a time machine, for pete's sake

Argh. You'd think the writers would have at least clued in to some of the things we complained about last season, but noooo.

although I'd be worried that someone at the party might have recognized the gown Lucy was wearing

MTE!

However, US patents can't be renewed

I didn't know that! Also, of course, the military in 62 might not have wanted to pay anything, no matter if the idea had been patented or not, and chances are they'd have easily convinced Hedy to use her design for free (or a small fee), anyway.

Jiya's storyline never made sense to me and it still doesn't. Why was she the only one affected by the four people riding in a time machine built for three dilemma?

Right? It's like the time machine chose the three people it knew and kept those intact, and then went "oh, who is this fourth person? let's screw them up!". Logically, the effect should have hit all the passengers from that trip, not just Jiya. Unless she's just somehow more sensitive to time travel than the others, but that's not what the writers have been telling us so far.

Also, how can you tell that the machine only fits three people? What kind of design decision went into that? Okay, they could have found out by accident (two dead/insane pilots), but once they did, couldn't they have done something about it? Modify the machine in a way that increases that limit somehow?

Aaand, that Rufus didn't know about the limit is such an artificial obstacle. It makes no sense.

But of course that all plays into the same problem, that the writers don't seem to know how time travel works. If your machine only fits three, then just make more than one trip! It's easy!

If the writers don't want that, they can always put a limit on trips by the energy consumption of the machine, like in Back to the Future. But that limit still only matters on one side of the trip (i.e. in the future, when it needs to recharge).

but they set it down right out in the open and did nothing to cover their tracks

They should invent a stealth/cloaking mechanism, like the Enterprise. :D Or the Tardis. :D:D

Speaking of the devil, now that Flynn has unofficially joined the Time Team, shouldn't there be more security, not less? How was he able to just waltz in?

I just assumed that Agent Christopher brought him with her. They probably defined a meetup point after his escape and she brought him to the bunker and settled him there. Since the bunker is already locked from the inside, I'd assumed no change in security is needed.

Although of course Wyatt managed to break out... *headdesk*
After he tried that the first time, I already expected Agent Christopher to assign human guards or something.

It stands to reason that eventually Flynn's escape is going to get tied to someone.

Oh, good point. But it's probably easy for Christopher to deflect blame onto Rittenhouse, if she's thought about the consequences of breaking him out at all.