Discussion Post: 2x08 "The Day Reagan Was Shot"

[wendelah1]

This is the discussion post for episode 2x08, "The Day Reagan Was Shot." It is meant for folks who are watching the show on the U.S./Canadian schedule, but you should feel free to join in any time after you've seen the episode. Please try to keep comments spoiler-free of anything that comes after season two, episode eight. Thank you!

Air Date: May 6, 2018 in the U.S. and Canada
Written by: Arkia Lisanne Mittman and Lauren Greer
Directed by: Alex Kalymnios

Memorable quote:
Lucy: For your first time, you did a nice job stealing clothes.
Jiya: I never met a security tag I couldn't deactivate.

Watch on YouTube

I'll post reviews, recaps, and other items of interest as soon as I spot 'em.

Recaps
Timeless recap: Young Agent Christopher to the rescue (EW)
Timeless Recap: How to Save a Life — Plus, Holy Jessica Twist! (TV Line)
Timeless Recap: Don’t Cry For Me, Christopher (Vulture)
Timeless Season 2, Episode 8 recap: Who does the Time Team really need to save? (Hidden Remote)
Timeless Season 2 Episode 8 Review: The Day Reagan Was Shot (Den of Geek)
Who Shot the Sheriff? ‘Timeless’ Season 2, Episode 8, Recapped (Smithsonian Magazine)
‘Timeless’ Review: When Cagney & Lacey Met Denise (TV Source Magazine)
‘Timeless’ 2×08 review: ‘The Day Ronald Reagan Was Shot’ hits the target dead on

Miscellaneous
Matt Lanter Teases the Life and Death Stakes of the Season Finale (Syfy.com)

Timeless interview: Sakina Jaffrey on Agent Christopher’s story, how to fight for renewal (Cartermatt)

Remember, if you can, watch in real time, tweet in real time, etc. If you're recording the episode to watch later, it doesn't count in the ratings. In that case, watch On Demand, or on Hulu, or at the NBC website. Those are the numbers that matter to the network because those are the numbers that matter to their advertisers.

What you need to do to help Timeless reach season 3

Comments

[earthspirits]

I thought it was an excellent episode. I love the focus on Denise Christopher and her family, and the happy resolution for her. Also adored Lucy and Jiya as a team, and the guys doing their thing to hunt the villains down.

Needless to say, while it was definitely a "Flynn lite" episode - I prefer he comes along on missions - the scenes where he did appear were fantastic. Enjoyed his pep talk with Christopher - and that Lucy went to him for answers about the journal. That she sought Flynn out was particularly intriguing - especially with what he revealed. That scene between them was so intense - Their chemistry sizzles!

And the reveal with Wyatt and Jessica was certainly quite a cliff hanger.

Can't believe the 2 part season finale is almost upon us, and keeping my fingers tightly crossed that the series is renewed for a S3.

[wendelah1]

Flynn played a important role, talking to Denise about his daughter, relating it to her wife and kids. That's the over-arching theme for the rest of the season, I would warrant. Family is a strength but it's also a pressure point that can be used against us, the way it was used against the sleeper agent, to coerce him to leave his family in 2018, and go back to 1969 and start all over again. It also forged a connection between them that I suspect will play a role in the future, assuming the show has a future.

Flynn and Lucy do have chemistry and it is all about the diary, imho. He knows things about her--or thinks he does--and it creates a kind of intimacy.

There are so many unanswered questions and frankly, I didn't believe his story about the bar in San Paolo. It didn't make sense, that she would just drop off the diary and walk away.

What seems clear to me is that Future!Lucy doesn't want events to go the same way this time around, and from Flynn's face when he told her that they would have "to wait and see what happens," he doesn't either. What I want to know is what did happen the first time (or the second or however many times they've replayed this scenario) that made Lucy write the journal in the first place, and travel back in time to give it to him. If Flynn had gotten his family back in the future, there would be no reason for him to be doing this again, and I don't believe Lucy would have risked his happiness unless something dire had happened in the original timeline. Whose life is she hoping to save? Is it his? Did Jiya's vision come true and they need to save Rufus? Did Rittenhouse actually win? If that's the case, maybe the journal could be a trap--maybe she wrote it under duress. We just don't know. We don't know why or exactly when she wrote it.

Here's the biggest unanswered question: if Lucy was able to travel back into a time that overlaps her own existence, why didn't she travel back a couple of weeks earlier and warn Flynn that Rittenhouse was coming after him and his family? For that matter, why can't she warn Wyatt about his wife's impending murder? Flynn must know the reason--it must be in the journal. Why the heck won't he just come clean, tell her and the rest of the team what it said and be done with it? There must be a reason.

The Wyatt and Jessica mess is only going to get messier. It's not just the pregnancy, assuming it's real--Rittenhouse changed not one but two things in her family's timeline. I think we are going to have to find out why--or not if the series gets cancelled.

[wendelah1]

Except for the final scene, which was awful, this was my favorite episode of the season, by far.

The backstory explained so much about Agent Christopher and made me love her even more than I already do.

Jiya and Lucy teaming up as "Cagney and Lacey" was adorable.

You gotta love those big glasses and bouffant hairstyles. Jiya shoplifting for souvenirs was cute.

Wyatt did a good job of saving Agent Christopher's life--twice. He did a terrible job of dealing with the Rittenhouse sleeper agent. If Rufus hadn't been there to remind Wyatt that they're supposed to be the good guys, he'd have killed the man in cold blood and walked away. I don't like how he's being written now at all. He's displaying terrible judgment and worse impulse control.

The writers continued their attempts to rehabilitate and humanize Garcia Flynn. I've always thought he was meant to be a more sympathetic character but they'd chosen to emphasize his terrifying side last season. This season he's still terrifying when he's not trying to get to know Lucy, or yank Rufus's chain. He dearly loves riling people up.

Jessica Logan. You are a very badly trained Rittenhouse agent. Even I was not fooled by the "I'm pregnant" line. Unfortunately, given that your husband is being written as clueless as the rest of the team, you'll probably get away with whatever you were sent to do.

The entire Jessica plot arc is a boondoggle of epic proportions. They got a Hail Mary second season and this what they wasted it on? I am this close to dumping this turkey right now. I can tell that it's going to end badly for everyone, especially Lucy and Wyatt. Wyatt has behaved like a jerk so I don't honestly care what happens to him but I do care about Lucy. She deserves so much better.

These writers are heartless.

Flynn's tall tale about Lucy walking into a bar in San Paolo and handing him the journal made no sense at all so it fits right into the rest of this trash heap of a season.

[tinny]

Except for the final scene, which was awful, this was my favorite episode of the season, by far.

Hey, look, we agree on something! :D

I don't like how he's being written now at all. He's displaying terrible judgment and worse impulse control.

*sigh* They're ruining his character, just like they ruined Flynn in season 1.

He dearly loves riling people up.

I actually like this about him, a lot. It makes the fanfic fun to read, too. A lot of writers have picked up on this.

Flynn's tall tale about Lucy walking into a bar in San Paolo and handing him the journal made no sense at all so it fits right into the rest of this trash heap of a season.

I wondered about that. Sao Paolo is huge, shouldn't he have told her exactly when and where she's going to meet him, so as to make it happen? That's what I expected.

Also, the important thing to ask about Flynn (which they're not doing, because they're trying to emphasize the love triangle meh) is if he ever gets his family back. Because that is the hook Lucy got him with, and either she was lying to him, or he will succeed at some point after all. But then the whole "romantic" plot would be shot, so they don't mention it. But they should! (I mean, he has her diary, they should have talked about what's in there, what the last entries are, that kind of thing. There are things in it that haven't happened yet! It's important!)

[wendelah1]

"*sigh* They're ruining his character, just like they ruined Flynn in season 1."

Yeah, he was always a bit of a hothead but this is out of control. I assume it is to put even more distance between him and Lucy. No one writing for TV knows how to write a good slow-burn anymore. Also to give him something (else) to atone for? I fear I see a sacrificial lamb waiting in the wings...

I actually like this about him, a lot. It makes the fanfic fun to read, too. A lot of writers have picked up on this.

Absolutely. Now that he's not as evil, Flynn is a hoot.

I wondered about that. Sao Paolo is huge, shouldn't he have told her exactly when and where she's going to meet him, so as to make it happen? That's what I expected.

I didn't. Future!Lucy doesn't want events to go the same way this time around, and from his face when he told her that they would have "to wait and see what happens," he doesn't either. What I want to know is what happened the first time around (or the second or however many times they've replayed this scenario) that made Lucy write the journal in the first place, and travel back in time to give it to him. If Flynn had gotten his family back, there would be no reason for him to be doing this again, and I don't believe she would have risked his happiness unless something dire had happened in the original timeline. Whose life is she hoping to save? Did Rittenhouse win?

Here's the biggest unanswered question: if she can travel back into a time that overlaps her own existence, why didn't she travel back a couple of weeks earlier and warn Flynn that Rittenhouse was coming after him and his family? Why can't she warn Wyatt about his wife's impending murder? Flynn must know the reason--it must be in the journal. Why the hell won't he just tell her and the rest of the team what it said and be done with it?

(I mean, he has her diary, they should have talked about what's in there, what the last entries are, that kind of thing. There are things in it that haven't happened yet! It's important!)

And things that didn't happen in that timeline that have happened in this one, right? Jessica must not have been in the journal or he would have said something when she showed up, right? We know when the journal starts. What we don't know is when it ends--or why it ends.

[tinny]

Okay, so I loved this episode, too. I have a huge weak spot for Agent Christopher, and I've been lamenting her lack of things to do this season.

This episode definitely made up for it. I can't even say how much I loved it, but I was crying throughout most of it. I'm counting that as a good thing. *g*

I'm not sure I really want to reiterate everything I loved, but if I just mention the few cringeworthy things (like Lucy hitting-not-hitting on Denise, or Lucy and Jiya pretending to be together, or Wyatt waffling over killing one brother and then brutally running over the other with his car), that wouldn't do the episode justice.

I'll just mention the one thing I loved most: the way Denise's sexuality is treated as normal. That is so refreshing, and Timeless has always done the big things right. Even though I didn't like most of this season because of the mess they made of the time team, they still get the important things right.

I was actually relieved that Wyatt was barely in this ep, and I also didn't miss Flynn.

That last scene with Jessica did not give us much new information, and wtf if she's trying to distract Wyatt by telling him she's pregnant? I would have expected him (and especially her) to be more careful about that, considering she's still finding her way back to him. I'm counting that under "the mess that is season 2" - the character motivations are all over the place. :/ But hey, that was just one tiny little thing, and the rest of the episode was so beautiful, I really don't care what Jessica had to say.

I am very glad that Denise got to keep her family, too. (Although I still don't know how she went from her mother not knowing about the kids to her loving them, when Lucy and Jiya did everything right and nothing changed in the timeline, for once.)

[wendelah1]

I'm not sure I really want to reiterate everything I loved, but if I just mention the few cringeworthy things (like Lucy hitting-not-hitting on Denise, or Lucy and Jiya pretending to be together, or Wyatt waffling over killing one brother and then brutally running over the other with his car), that wouldn't do the episode justice.

The first two things didn't bother me. They're add-libbing. It can get awkward, especially when you're doing your best to interfere in your future boss's life to keep her from making a life-and-history-changing mistake.

I don't think Wyatt intended to run the sleeper agent's assassin brother, the assassin, down--I don't think Wyatt had much of a choice, given that the guy had a huge head start on him. From the POV of a soldier, that man was trying to kill his future commanding officer. He was not an innocent civilian. The sleeper agent wasn't either but he was in effect a prisoner of war, and Rufus shouldn't have had to remind him of that. What bothered me was this went down in the middle of a residential street and the neighbors didn't open their doors to see what had happened.

What pinged me about this week's sleeper agent plot, besides Agent Christopher of course, is what Wyatt said about the sleeper agent after they'd found he'd hung himself. He wasn't there completely of his own free will. He was there to save his family, not to serve Rittenhouse, and he didn't know until that morning that he was going to be expected to kill for them. "In a way, he was a victim, too." I think this new insight will turn out to be important.

(Although I still don't know how she went from her mother not knowing about the kids to her loving them, when Lucy and Jiya did everything right and nothing changed in the timeline, for once.)

What changed is that instead of dodging her mother's attempts to marry her off, she accepted an offer and had to recant it. After showing Denise the slideshow of her family that she herself had made, Lucy told her that she had to tell her mother the truth about herself--"before someone gets hurt." She and her mom had some rough patches but eventually her mom came around. Knowing what was possible--what she believed was possible--gave her hope, and that gave her strength for her journey. Yeah, I was crying, too. It was so, so good.

That last scene with Jessica did not give us much new information, and wtf if she's trying to distract Wyatt by telling him she's pregnant? I would have expected him (and especially her) to be more careful about that, considering she's still finding her way back to him. I'm counting that under "the mess that is season 2" - the character motivations are all over the place. :/ But hey, that was just one tiny little thing, and the rest of the episode was so beautiful, I really don't care what Jessica had to say.

She's trying to distract him because Wyatt found out that her brother is alive in this timeline. Instead of dying of leukemia at age three, the brother was given some "stem cell" treatment that doesn't even exist in our timeline, dear script writers. We know Rittenhouse went back to 1980. Whatever they did, it changed Jessica's life, not once but twice. That should be sending up a huge red flag for Wyatt. I didn't want to believe it but she must be connected to them. She would have been just a kid but maybe they went back to recruit her family in 1980 in return for saving her brother? Maybe they threatened to change history again if she didn't agree to work for them? Or maybe she drank the Koolaid, just like the sleep agent's brother did. We don't know. Given that the series is probably doomed, we may never know.